Myrkris
2006-05-09, 08:41 AM
In the last couple of MC raids, Rehab has been taking dirt naps with Jabber-like frequency. While you may think "he's MT2, that's not surprising" we're not supposed to be losing our MT 2 any more than we are supposed to lose MT 1. If we keep both of them up, we'll move faster. It's really that simple. But why all the deaths?
To start with, it isn't the amount of healing he's assigned. MT1 and MT2 have the same healing setup - a priest, a druid, and a shaman. To the best of my knowledge, I've only been assigning healing-specced people to those positions and they are all experienced raiders. That being the case, MT 2 shouldn't be dying more often than MT 1 unless there is a vast gear disparity (there isn't).
One part of the answer is dumb luck, though somewhat controllable luck. One of Rehab's deaths last night was on an Annihilator, which should raise a bit "WTF?" flag for all of us since they're trivial mobs. It was so surprising that Sol gave him shit about it over Vent. Raid healer mana was tolerable for a pull like that, though it was only about 25% due to the previous pull being a double destroyer pull. However, what Rehab didn't know was that 2 of his 3 assigned healers (the priest and druid) had died on the destroyer pull and had no mana or buffs when he pulled the Anni. The rest of us didn't manage to adjust, and he took one of his dirt naps.
A similar problem happened on the third Lava Pack, where he was simply out of LOS and range of his healers when he died. That's a recurring problem with that Lava Pack since it's such a long pull, and we should really consider either taking that one after Geddon or figuring out how to pull it without our tanks taking so much damage on the pull.
We also had problems with Rath going LD last raid, including during pulls. He was one of Rehab's healers, which may have contributed to the problems since adjusting to something like that takes time that an MT may not have.
While there is an element of bad luck in some MT deaths like these, we can limit that with better communication, coordination, and healing performance.
First, communication. The MTs have gotten away from saying anything over Vent or in /raid to alert us when they're pulling. Sometimes it happens, sometimes it doesn't. If the raid doesn't know a mob (or lava pack, even worse) is incoming, there will be a lag in our reactions to the pull. Since we're dealing with mobs that can do thousands of damage in a second or two, any extra lag beyond the normal reaction time can get people killed. We need an pull announcement for every pull, especially because the healers need to know WHO is pulling so they don't get caught off guard by damage to an unexpected target.
Just pulling doesn't work, because we healers frequently can't see it happening. Terrain and bodies become big obstacles when you're sitting down and drinking. If the first warning we have of a pull coming in is people taking damage, we're much more likely to lose people.
Second, coordination. All of us in any leadership position bear some responsibility for this, because it's pretty opaque unless you are in the right chat channels. First, there's a pattern to the MT assignments that isn't normally spelled out for the raid as a whole. MT 1 and MT 2 are basically alternate raid tanks on trash fights. They trade off pulling to allow us to chain pull, and thus move faster. That means the healer groups for both MT 1 and MT 2 need to be on the ball on every pull since their assignment may be pulling the next mob during the current fight.
MT 3 and 4 are normally the backup tanks for MT 1 and 2, respectively. It's their primary job to pick up aggro on the MT 1 and 2 targets if those tanks go down. This means the MT 3 and 4 healers need to be on the ball and react right away if their assigned tank picks up a mob mid-fight. The healers on the MT that goes down should also be switching to help cover the backup as well as doing more raid healing, since some of the normal raid healers are switching to a focus on their MT.
MT 5 is normally the bailout tank. That's the warrior who is supposed to pick up any unexpected adds like a wandering ACH or a FL that we got too close to during a fight. When something like that happens, the MT 5 healers need to switch away from raid healing and they may need help from other general raid healers, depending on what added.
Beyond that general pattern, we really don't coordinate all that well between healers and tanks. While the healing coordinator is usually in the warrior channel, there has never been any of the main raid tanks in the healing channel as far as I know. As a result, they don't know who is assigned to what coverage and can't adapt to that. If Rehab had known that 2 of his three healers had died on the previous fight and just been rezzed, he might have either delayed pulling the Anni or alerted us that he was pulling so other healers could cover him for that fight. Instead, all he had to work with was raid healing mana and that didn't tell him that HIS healers were OOM. Both the MT 1 and MT 2 should be in hawcheal during MC raids so they're aware of issues like that.
A further coordination issue is buffing after deaths, particularly on trash. People who die shouldn't need to ask for a rebuff, especially not repeatedly. Buffers (druids, priests, and mages) shouldn't need to be reminded by their class coordinators to rebuff either. Both of those are common, though. I've had to ask 3-4 times for rebuff after dying, which demonstrates that some people need to pay attention a lot more than they are. I don't know how the mages do it, but the priests and druids are assigned a group for buffs and they are responsible for that group for the entire raid. That means they need to be aware of any need for rebuff, and take care of it. If they can't rebuff right away, at least acknowledge the need so that those of us waiting for the buffs don't have to keep asking and wondering wtf is going on.
Finally, there are a couple of things I've seen the MT healers do that can contribute to unnecessary MT deaths (I'm guilty of these as well). The first is drinking at the wrong time, and in the wrong place. Right after the fight most of us drink right away, which is exactly what we should be doing. However, if the MTs are rushing off to get to the next mob and we're sitting on our asses back at the bodies of the previous fight, we're not going to be in range when we need to heal. If you're assigned to MT 1, MT 2, or the MA and the raid moves, you should move with them regardless of your mana supply. Stay in range, and drink during the opening stages of the fight if you need to drink. Don't worry about "wasting" mana, the mages will supply more if you run out.
The second is trying to do everyone's job. The good healers, and we've got a lot of good healers in HAWC, take it personally when a group or raid member dies. They feel like it shouldn't have happened on their watch. That's all well and good, but NO ONE can keep an entire 40-person raid up. Trying to do so unnecessarily drains your mana, so it is normally counterproductive because it can put you on your ass, drinking when your MT needs you on the next pull.
Installing Scrolling Combat Text showed me how pervasive this is. One time, I was down about 2k in hp (so not in any danger) and I got hit with heals from 5 different healers in less than a second, totaling at least 5k in health. THREE of those healers were assigned to either MT1 or MT2, while the other two were assigned to raid healing.
In another instance, I watched one of the healers assigned to the MT healing rotation for the golemagg fight run over to Rehab's position and cast a heal about 6 times last Sunday night. Since it's no problem for a priest and a shaman to keep one of the off-tanks up during that fight, I have no idea wtf he was thinking.
Healers, do YOUR job and TRUST your fellow healers to do theirs. If you heal someone you don't need to heal and end up short of mana during the next fight or out of range of your MT because you're drinking, you made a mistake. To make chain pulling work requires us to conserve mana so we're ready for the next fight. That doesn't mean let someone die who you could save, but don't heal unassigned targets who are over 50% health. If everyone focuses on their assignment and only steps out of it when it's an emergency, the whole raid will actually run better. It'll also help us figure out if anyone ISN'T doing their job well, so we can coach them.
Wow, this got longer than I planned. I'm not naming names, because there's no point or value in doing so. If you're not in any of these roles, you can still benefit by learning more about how the raid works. If you're a healer or MT, think about what applies to your situation and feel free to discard the rest. If you have suggestions or comments to help improve these aspects, please make them since we can all benefit from talking about things like this.
To start with, it isn't the amount of healing he's assigned. MT1 and MT2 have the same healing setup - a priest, a druid, and a shaman. To the best of my knowledge, I've only been assigning healing-specced people to those positions and they are all experienced raiders. That being the case, MT 2 shouldn't be dying more often than MT 1 unless there is a vast gear disparity (there isn't).
One part of the answer is dumb luck, though somewhat controllable luck. One of Rehab's deaths last night was on an Annihilator, which should raise a bit "WTF?" flag for all of us since they're trivial mobs. It was so surprising that Sol gave him shit about it over Vent. Raid healer mana was tolerable for a pull like that, though it was only about 25% due to the previous pull being a double destroyer pull. However, what Rehab didn't know was that 2 of his 3 assigned healers (the priest and druid) had died on the destroyer pull and had no mana or buffs when he pulled the Anni. The rest of us didn't manage to adjust, and he took one of his dirt naps.
A similar problem happened on the third Lava Pack, where he was simply out of LOS and range of his healers when he died. That's a recurring problem with that Lava Pack since it's such a long pull, and we should really consider either taking that one after Geddon or figuring out how to pull it without our tanks taking so much damage on the pull.
We also had problems with Rath going LD last raid, including during pulls. He was one of Rehab's healers, which may have contributed to the problems since adjusting to something like that takes time that an MT may not have.
While there is an element of bad luck in some MT deaths like these, we can limit that with better communication, coordination, and healing performance.
First, communication. The MTs have gotten away from saying anything over Vent or in /raid to alert us when they're pulling. Sometimes it happens, sometimes it doesn't. If the raid doesn't know a mob (or lava pack, even worse) is incoming, there will be a lag in our reactions to the pull. Since we're dealing with mobs that can do thousands of damage in a second or two, any extra lag beyond the normal reaction time can get people killed. We need an pull announcement for every pull, especially because the healers need to know WHO is pulling so they don't get caught off guard by damage to an unexpected target.
Just pulling doesn't work, because we healers frequently can't see it happening. Terrain and bodies become big obstacles when you're sitting down and drinking. If the first warning we have of a pull coming in is people taking damage, we're much more likely to lose people.
Second, coordination. All of us in any leadership position bear some responsibility for this, because it's pretty opaque unless you are in the right chat channels. First, there's a pattern to the MT assignments that isn't normally spelled out for the raid as a whole. MT 1 and MT 2 are basically alternate raid tanks on trash fights. They trade off pulling to allow us to chain pull, and thus move faster. That means the healer groups for both MT 1 and MT 2 need to be on the ball on every pull since their assignment may be pulling the next mob during the current fight.
MT 3 and 4 are normally the backup tanks for MT 1 and 2, respectively. It's their primary job to pick up aggro on the MT 1 and 2 targets if those tanks go down. This means the MT 3 and 4 healers need to be on the ball and react right away if their assigned tank picks up a mob mid-fight. The healers on the MT that goes down should also be switching to help cover the backup as well as doing more raid healing, since some of the normal raid healers are switching to a focus on their MT.
MT 5 is normally the bailout tank. That's the warrior who is supposed to pick up any unexpected adds like a wandering ACH or a FL that we got too close to during a fight. When something like that happens, the MT 5 healers need to switch away from raid healing and they may need help from other general raid healers, depending on what added.
Beyond that general pattern, we really don't coordinate all that well between healers and tanks. While the healing coordinator is usually in the warrior channel, there has never been any of the main raid tanks in the healing channel as far as I know. As a result, they don't know who is assigned to what coverage and can't adapt to that. If Rehab had known that 2 of his three healers had died on the previous fight and just been rezzed, he might have either delayed pulling the Anni or alerted us that he was pulling so other healers could cover him for that fight. Instead, all he had to work with was raid healing mana and that didn't tell him that HIS healers were OOM. Both the MT 1 and MT 2 should be in hawcheal during MC raids so they're aware of issues like that.
A further coordination issue is buffing after deaths, particularly on trash. People who die shouldn't need to ask for a rebuff, especially not repeatedly. Buffers (druids, priests, and mages) shouldn't need to be reminded by their class coordinators to rebuff either. Both of those are common, though. I've had to ask 3-4 times for rebuff after dying, which demonstrates that some people need to pay attention a lot more than they are. I don't know how the mages do it, but the priests and druids are assigned a group for buffs and they are responsible for that group for the entire raid. That means they need to be aware of any need for rebuff, and take care of it. If they can't rebuff right away, at least acknowledge the need so that those of us waiting for the buffs don't have to keep asking and wondering wtf is going on.
Finally, there are a couple of things I've seen the MT healers do that can contribute to unnecessary MT deaths (I'm guilty of these as well). The first is drinking at the wrong time, and in the wrong place. Right after the fight most of us drink right away, which is exactly what we should be doing. However, if the MTs are rushing off to get to the next mob and we're sitting on our asses back at the bodies of the previous fight, we're not going to be in range when we need to heal. If you're assigned to MT 1, MT 2, or the MA and the raid moves, you should move with them regardless of your mana supply. Stay in range, and drink during the opening stages of the fight if you need to drink. Don't worry about "wasting" mana, the mages will supply more if you run out.
The second is trying to do everyone's job. The good healers, and we've got a lot of good healers in HAWC, take it personally when a group or raid member dies. They feel like it shouldn't have happened on their watch. That's all well and good, but NO ONE can keep an entire 40-person raid up. Trying to do so unnecessarily drains your mana, so it is normally counterproductive because it can put you on your ass, drinking when your MT needs you on the next pull.
Installing Scrolling Combat Text showed me how pervasive this is. One time, I was down about 2k in hp (so not in any danger) and I got hit with heals from 5 different healers in less than a second, totaling at least 5k in health. THREE of those healers were assigned to either MT1 or MT2, while the other two were assigned to raid healing.
In another instance, I watched one of the healers assigned to the MT healing rotation for the golemagg fight run over to Rehab's position and cast a heal about 6 times last Sunday night. Since it's no problem for a priest and a shaman to keep one of the off-tanks up during that fight, I have no idea wtf he was thinking.
Healers, do YOUR job and TRUST your fellow healers to do theirs. If you heal someone you don't need to heal and end up short of mana during the next fight or out of range of your MT because you're drinking, you made a mistake. To make chain pulling work requires us to conserve mana so we're ready for the next fight. That doesn't mean let someone die who you could save, but don't heal unassigned targets who are over 50% health. If everyone focuses on their assignment and only steps out of it when it's an emergency, the whole raid will actually run better. It'll also help us figure out if anyone ISN'T doing their job well, so we can coach them.
Wow, this got longer than I planned. I'm not naming names, because there's no point or value in doing so. If you're not in any of these roles, you can still benefit by learning more about how the raid works. If you're a healer or MT, think about what applies to your situation and feel free to discard the rest. If you have suggestions or comments to help improve these aspects, please make them since we can all benefit from talking about things like this.